Jay Feldman 0:12
Welcome to Episode 25 of the energy balance podcast, where we teach you how to live without constant hunger and fatigue, brain fog, poor sleep and any other low energy symptoms by maximizing your cellular energy. I'm Jay Feldman. I am a health coach and independent health researcher, and joining me again today is my good friend Mike Fave who has been studying health and nutrition with me for quite a while now, and also draws on his experiences from working within the healthcare industry. Today's episode is part three of our three part series talking about slowing aging and extending lifespan. In part one, we discussed the different theories of aging and why increasing our metabolism and our cellular energy is the key to slowing aging and extending lifespan. And in part two, we talked about the problems with the calorie restriction research, which we're told is the optimal way to slow aging and extend lifespan. And we also talked about why avoiding the polyunsaturated fats, the Omega sixes and omega threes, is so important for increasing longevity and slowing aging. And so if you did not listen to those episodes, then definitely go check those out. And today, in part three, we're going to be talking about diet, exercise and stress in relation to aging and lifespan. So we'll be talking about the problems with a lot of the exercise recommendations, and we'll be going through the best types and amounts of exercise in order to slow aging and extend lifespan. We'll also be talking about stress in relation to aging, and that includes the stress hormones and physiological stress as well as psychological stress. So we'll be talking about how to optimize our diet to minimize both types of stress, and then also other aspects of our lifestyle that come into play here, like our social interaction and our communities and spending time in nature. And then, as far as diet is concerned, we'll be diving into some of the details, as far as how to balance the different amino acids in our protein intake. And we'll also talk a little bit about optimizing our gut health, making sure we're getting enough carbs and calories, and why all of this matters when it comes to longevity and slowing aging. To check out the show notes for today's episode, head over to Jay Feldman wellness.com/podcast where I'll link to any of the articles or studies or anything else we discuss on today's episode. And if you are looking to improve any symptoms of aging, whether that's chronic pain or joint pain, maybe it's weight gain or some gut symptoms like bloating or indigestion, or if you're dealing with any other low energy symptoms, whether that is fatigue or maybe excessive amounts of cravings and hunger or hormonal imbalances, or maybe you're not sleeping well, head over to Jay Feldman wellness.com/energy, where you can sign up for a free energy balance mini course, where I'll teach you why energy is really at the root, or I should say a lack of energy is really at the root of all of these symptoms and all sorts of other chronic health conditions, whether that's auto immune issues or diabetes or heart disease or anything else that we might be experiencing. And then I'll also walk you through the main things that we'll want to focus on as far as diet and lifestyle are concerned, in order to optimize our cellular energy systems. So to sign up for that free energy balance mini course, head over to Jay Feldman wellness.com/energy, and with that, let's get started.Circling back to endotoxin that you talked about, and just gut health in general. Again, all of this is coming back to what is supporting us the most on as far as the ability to support energy production, not wasting energy, not not degrading the efficiency of it, and not, you know, not leading to excessive damage that we have to waste energy to repair things like that. So as far as gut health goes, there are, you know, microbial overgrowth are very common, whether it is fungal or bacterial or whatever. And the when we feed these, when we're eating things that get digested by these microbes, they produce toxins. Endotoxin is one of the most commonly studied, and there are others that are produced by other bacteria and other fungi, and they directly, among other things, they create cascades of signals, and then also directly block our ability to produce energy. And so just looking at on that front makes it clear that these things are not good for longevity and lifespan. And so this is the reason why. It's just worth mentioning. There are lots there are lots of things that inhibit our ability to produce energy. This is just one of the most common ones. And so it is definitely very important to make sure that you're improving your ability to digest and absorb foods. You're eating foods that are easily digested and absorbable and that work well for you based on your current digestive situation. And addressing any of these overgrowth and things like that.Mike 5:03 Yeah, yeah, I'd say, I'd say between PUFA and endotoxin, those are two of the biggest players. And I guess the next one we can talk about is making sure that you have enough calories on board of the foods, of protective foods, that you are able to keep thyroid high and keep your androgens and progesterones and things like that, high and avoid running too hard in stress pathways like cortisol and chronic and chronically running on those stress pathways. I mean, you're going to have times where you're going to have adrenaline rush. If you're going to work out in the gym, you're going to have some adrenaline there's times where cortisol is going to spike in different situations, whether that's a psychological situation or things like that, you can't entirely get rid of all stress in your life. So those argument but it's the avoidance of chronic elevations of these adaptive hormones and things like like gut inflammation can chronically elevate cortisol and things like that, through via endotoxin and things like that. So it's important to keep that low. But the other way is having enough carbohydrate on board from easily digestive sources, and that really again, that there's some individual variation with that. Some people do better with certain starches. Some people do better with fruits and juice. So making sure you're eating enough of those, and then making sure you're having adequate fat sources from saturated fatty acids, monounsaturated fatty acids, and we've gone through these before, beef tallow, butter, coconut oil, COA butter, macadamia oil, things like that are, are really helpful, and then making sure you have adequate protein intake. And there's, there's some theories about decreasing the thinning and tryptophan and cysteine, like we talked about above. Um, and then there's the whole ideas now of protein fasting and things like that. Um, what I would, what my recommendation would be, is because, I mean, I guess you could protein fast certain days of the week if you really wanted to, but I think a decent amount of protein is helpful and overall for maintaining muscle mass, maintaining liver function and things like that. And then you can basically balance out some of these amino acids by taking in proteins like collagen or gelatin, depending on what or bone broth, depending on what agrees with your stomach or what agrees with your gut. I mean, I wouldn't say to continue to take something if it's if it's irritating, you are not agreeing with you. And this is basically because of the high amount of glycine and proline within the collagen protein that can balance out methionine and trip. And it does. The collagen actually doesn't have a high amount of tryptophan, so, so yeah, a decent amount of collagen can balance out some some of these other proteins that you get in muscle meats, whether that's steak or chicken or seafood or whatnot. So yeah, keeping your calories high, keeping macro nutrients high, which will in turn and keeping toxins and stressful foods low, will help to keep your thyroid high and your reproductive hormones high, like your androgens, testosterone, dihydrotestosterone, DHEA, and then your progestogens, progesterone, and then keep little we keep your cortisol and your adrenaline and whatnot on the lower end. And that's, I think, important overall, for longevity.Yeah, and...I think it's important, especially when you consider the effects of the adaptive hormones over the long term.Right. Yeah, absolutely. And in talking about so you brought up a few things that are all important, as far as the protein side goes. We talked about how methionine and cysteine and tryptophan in particular can drive aging and lifespan, and a lot of the caloric restriction benefits can be attributed to just reductions in those things. But as you said, that doesn't mean we need to avoid the protein overall. We don't need a protein fast or eat a low protein diet instead, as long as we're balancing out those amino acids with the protective ones, glycine, proline, hydroxyproline, among others, those that will help mitigate those effects. So as you said, in muscle meat, which is most of the meat that people eat, and in seafood and dairy as well, you get more of those, those amino acids, the methionine, tryptophan, cysteine, so balancing those out with connective tissue that's in foods, whether that's the tougher meats that you need to cook longer and slower a lot of the roasts, or protein from the bones, whether it's it's like beef oxtail, yeah, skin as well, or just doing like a bone broth and again, collagen and gelatin is the protein that's in those places, then that will help to balance on those amino acids and protect against those, those aging and life or anti longevity effects. So it's so it's not a matter of just avoiding those things that as long as they're balanced out as they naturally would be, because. Yes, we would be eating the entire animal, and that would that would include those anti inflammatory things. So yeah, yeah. And in talking about just the general stress hormone factor here, and metabolism in general, the stress hormones are released in response to a lack of energy. So when we are exercising, for example, yes, there's going to be stress hormone release. And as you said, we don't want it to be chronic. But the other thing too is, if there are a lot of things blocking energy production, if it's not very efficient, then not only will will it necessarily be chronic. The other thing we want to avoid is just the necessity for large amounts, even in the short term. So a small amount of these stress adaptive stress hormones should be enough to stimulate things in a way that allows us to support our needs when we're exercising, for example. But if you have a not like a an inefficient engine, you need a much stronger signal, and that leads to even a stronger acute response. And then if you have such little efficiency that when you're just day to day at a higher, chronically elevated stress hormone level, that's even worse. So there are levels here, but it all ties back to our ability to produce energy, and the stress hormones are just a representation of an inability to do that, and that's why things like endotoxin and PUFA and all these other factors we've discussed are so important when it comes to Beijing and longevity.So the picture as as much as it seems complicated, the picture basically breaks down to avoiding toxic or irritating things and then making sure you have enough of the building blocks and necessary components going forward, and that that's basically what the what the picture is and to and the reason there's there's, there is a degree of individuality to this. So some and it really comes down in some extent, and some instances, to people really testing out the different foods that work for them and things like that. And so what we're providing here is just basic ideas or basic foods to try basic guidelines to sort of work out. And we have other episodes where we talk about different macronutrient ratios and and and to try and different caloric intakes and different foods and how to set up a diet and things like that. We have gone over those things. So there are episodes in that, and I guess you can link to them Jay.Yeah,well, and talking about that too, when people are I know you mentioned increasing calories, increasing carbs, and of course, many people will be concerned about weight gain in those instances. And we did a few episodes talking about that. So I will link to those episodes too.Yeah. So, yeah, it just comes. It basically comes down to avoiding the toxic things. And this is a broad definition of toxic at this point. We've talked to the talked about what some of those are, at ad nauseum, and then making sure you have enough nutrients on board making, and that's micro and macronutrients to make sure that everything's going well. The other thing I want to point out, and this is tangential, but in regards to the protein fasting thing, and like, decreasing protein and things like that in the study, just to bring this back up, when they decrease protein in the animals, they had, like, severely decreased body weights and failure to grow and things like that. So those are really important to point out. I mean, you may have a longer lifespan, but you may be a little bit frail, and when you get so this is somewhat opinion based, but when you get there's, there are theories of aging that involves sarcopenia, which is muscle loss, and then frailty as you get older and when you become an older adult, 7080, years old, or if you already are in those age groups, falling and breaking a hip and then winding up in the hospital is not a good place to be, and outcomes from there are not positive. So have it so doing something like protein fasting over an extended period of time, because it increases your lifespan, but at the same time, it also decreases body weight and muscle mass and things like that. And you get older and you fall and you break your hip and you just, it's just not, I don't think it's a good idea overall, based on the side effect profile, based on the idea of quality of life, and especially when you're looking at the effects in the studies of the animals that are protein restricting, things like that. So.Yeah. Well, it's like, if you're getting enough of one nutrient, but you're deficient in another, it doesn't so you're imbalanced. It doesn't make sense to just reduce the one that you're taking too much of, just make sure you're correcting the deficiency. So in this case, if there's a deficiency in the protective amino acids. Don't create a deficiency in methionine and cysteine and tryptophan. Just to balance that out, just make sure you're increasing the protective amino acids and some I mean, that might require eating less of those muscle meats and things, which is fine. I mean, we don't want an excessive amount there. But instead, just balance out the ones that are deficient that we should be getting a lot of.And we talked about amounts of protein from the research that seemed to maximize maintenance of muscle from multiple different measures, whether it's nitrogen retention or amino acid oxidation and things like that, without going into burning protein. I mean, there's a lot on the other side of the dietary sphere right now you have the whole body building idea with two times, three times your body weight and protein, just, or whatever, grams and protein a day, like 300 grams of protein a day, just crazy things, which, I mean, if you're on steroids and your goal is the fitness model and and things like that, it's a different story. But from a health perspective, having that much protein may not necessarily be necessary. May not be necessary. It may it be better to be fill in with good fat sources and carbs and things like that, especially from a hormonal profile perspective, and especially from a liver perspective and and ammonia perspective and things like that.Yeah, yeah, the excess protein requires stress hormones to be converted to carbohydrates, and that's the biggest, well, one of the bigger concerns there, and as you mentioned, ammonia is a byproduct there. So there, yeah, there are concerns there. And it also typically means that you end up not getting enough of the other nutrients, the other macronutrients, like carbs, typically, people are overeating protein. Are doing it because they're depriving themselves of enough carbohydrates. And, yeah, another fact. So when we did talk about this before, I think it was in that macro nutrient episode, which I will link to, but the research does point to around 0.7 grams per pound of body weight, being that that kind of ideal area, which is a lot less than two grams per pound or...Whatever. Yeah, there's some crazy there's some crazy amounts of protein. I've seen people say that they eat. The other thing I want to point out here is that in a lot of these things, there's and depending on where you're reading and things like that, people see that, oh, if I reduce this one thing, or I add this one thing in a certain amount, and it has a beneficial effect. Then if I do, if I reduce it way more, or I add way more than the effects, going to be even better. And a lot of times, at least in my experience with a lot of this stuff, is there's a Goldilocks zone, or a sort of, like a balance point where you need some of these things. So for example, on the ray peat form, and things like that, lowering iron, getting your iron really low, and things like that, and or and making sure that you're not storing excess iron. Yes, excess iron is a problem for sure. And storing excess iron is a sign of something going on, especially if you're pushing high amounts of ferritin. And then there's certain diseases like hemochromatosis, which is like a genetic disease, a genetic iron storage disease, where you have way too much iron, those all cause problems. But being very deficient in iron is also a problem. Being anemic is also a problem. So with all of these things, I mean, with to some extent perception, with PUFA, there's, there is a Goldilocks zone. There isn't that there is some degree of necessary amount. The question is, where is that necessary amount? And even with PUFA, is, if there is a we have, we don't know what the specific requirement is, especially in fully grown adults, we know, yeah, if there even is one with so far we know that it is pretty low. We know that overall, there is a low amount required. So there, it's, to some extent, there is maybe a Goldilocks zone there, there is a very small amount required and whatnot. And the question is finding out what that is, not doing something like and especially as the example, the iron going having completely zero iron because have because having too much iron is toxic. I mean, there is a balance to some of this stuff in this. And I bring this up because it goes also with the protein. Example, you need some protein. Having too much protein is problematic, and having less protein in some of these rat studies. And I think was a primate studies, you can have an increase in lifespan, but at what cost? So you have to find sort of that intersecting point on the graph that that balancing area where you're having enough protein to to carry out whatever functions that you need, while at the same time decreasing, not having too much that you have physiologic issues from it.Yeah. And just to touch on the the iron conversation as well, part of the issue with anemia also is, is not necessarily the amount of iron, but also where it is and it not being in the right place. And there's, you know, deficiencies in copper and zinc can be implicated there, and it's a much larger conversation, but, but yeah, it's definitely not as simple as just less iron or just more iron. And as far as the PUFA and essential fatty acid deficiency idea goes, I mean, we can, like, dig into the weeds there. And why the essential fatty acid deficiency, at least the studies looking at it. And mice or rodents, I don't remember if those rats or mice the issues. With that study and how, once they just had enough of the right nutrients, it was fine, and they didn't see problems with the deficiency so much. There's, of course, there are still arguments for essential fatty acids being actually essential being, you know, the polyunsaturated fats, the omega threes and Omega six is being essential. But as you said, it's if they are at such a small amount that it's really a moot point. I mean, you're assuming you're eating food, like real food, and you're not avoiding fat altogether, like unless you're eating a very extreme diet. It's almost impossible not to meet those requirements without trying. So it really is, I don't even see that, like, that much value in going real deep into that discussion. Yeah.No my point is just that there's, there's a balance point, or there's a Goldilocks zone for nutrients in general, or different concepts in general and and going too far in the extremes, neither direction. And this is not an argument for moderation. This is an argument for finding what that point is. Yeah, it's not a just well, since there's all these points, these gold these Goldilocks zones, or these, these balance points, or these ranges that make the most sense. Well, I'm just going to do everything in moderation. Well, I mean, I think it's more important to find out what those points are for your for the per an individual's context, and things like that, and at least, or an estimator get close to it, yeah, and then sort of go from there, yeah.Yeah. And I wasn't, I was, I was more saying that there's a lot of discussion about whether essential fatigues are actually essential or not, and people really like make a big deal of it. And just saying, yeah, see it as that valuable conversation. But, but, yeah, no, I definitely agree with what you're saying where, yeah, you said it well, so I'll just leave it there. I won't, I won't add anything to it. I wanted to talk a little bit more about some some other things that people talk about in terms, and this is actually really good. You were actually kind of discussing this. Yes, a good segue. As far as some things that people talk about do extend, things that do extend lifespan and slow aging that are not carbon, calorie restriction, which are which one of the big ones is exercise, and then some other hormetic type factors, which I think we mentioned a little bit earlier in the episode, where the I would definitely say that there are benefits to exercise, and those can include lengthening lifespan and slowing aging. But I think it's important to note that it's not the stress from exercise that's beneficial. There are other components of exercise that are beneficial and movement that are beneficial. And so when we and it's just an important distinction to make, because if we start to believe that the stress is what is ideal, and that we just need to be getting the right amount of stress and enough stress, it leads to it leads to recommendations like excessive amounts of exercise, it leads to a lot of other, what are called hormetic factors, like resveratrol, for example, and various other various other components and compounds that cause direct damage in small amounts, at least when they're when they're experienced in small amounts, this argument that they're beneficial for lifespan and for aging because they cause a small amount of stress and cause us to adapt to that by improving our own defenses. And I don't at all think that's the case. I've written a couple articles extensively talking about hormesis and the problems with it and why, when there are, I mean, there's a couple issues. Part of it is, is these poor extrapolations from these components. And I know we talked about this with calorie restriction research, where there are so many factors accounting for why calorie restriction does extend lifespan in these studies, and none of them are distressed from it and so and the same thing goes with, with those other components, and then the other, the other side of it as well, is, is they are looking at the stress in a very reductionist context, where they're looking at just certain markers that are supposedly associated with longevity, or they're looking at it in certain organisms like C elegans, for example, where extensions and longevity don't translate to extensions in health span. They don't improve the quality of life. They wouldn't extend to lifespan outside of the lab, and they wouldn't extend to lifespan in humans. So it's just a, I mean, that's just kind of a very, very brief overview as to why a lot of the anti aging supplements out there, which work through these hermesis pathways, are not actually anti aging. I would argue that they're pro aging. They directly cause stress and damage. They inhibit our ability to produce energy, or they lead to the direct wasting of energy, which does cause an adaptive response, but not in a beneficial way. They cause a stressful response that, as we've talked about, adds up in a way that eventually depresses metabolism and again, that doesn't mean that we can, can or should entirely avoid these stresses. It's a part of all sorts of aspects of life, including movement, exercise, whatever, but we do want to be minimizing them, and we don't want to be doing things just because they increase stress. It's not the stress that's beneficial to these other components, and it's just, I find it a very important distinction to make, especially when talking. Talking about aging and lifespan, because that's one of the main areas that that people in favor of this hormesis idea are focusing on, yeah. So did you want to go specifically with exercise? I mean, we can talk through some basic recommendations if we want. We have talked about it a little bit in those weight loss episodes too. But, I mean, what I would say is, overall, we just want to be doing it in a way that's minimal on the stressful side, but still maximal on the movement side, and maximal and the benefits and the the most basic way to evaluate that is considering how you feel afterwards. You shouldn't feel exhausted and wipe out, wiped out for the rest of the day or the following day. We should feel pretty good after even if we are tired for a little bit, we should feel pretty good after that point. We don't want to be causing excess amounts of stress. So the way that we feel after these things is the best way, and the way that we feel going into it too, where we should be in a position where we want to be moving and if we don't, oftentimes that can be a sign of already being under stress and not having the energy available to to, probably, to to move without, without making things worse, in which case, just a gentler form of exercise is normally a good option, like walking instead of or in the gym and doing sprints.Or decreasing volume or or because the thing is, is there's prescriptions for, there's general guidelines and prescriptions for different especially with Bodybuilding and stuff like that, for volume and stuff and whatnot, but at the same time, you have to be able to recover from what you're doing. And so the excessive stress comes in when you're doing things that you just cannot recover from, and then where your adaptive process is in slowing down the system because your body cannot recover from what's going on. So the point is to not get into that range. The point is to not have to tap into those reserves and things like that. And this is from a health perspective. If you want to be Mr. Olympia, that's a different perspective. That's a different marathon runner, or a marathon like an Olympian athlete, yeah.Those are, those are different perspectives. Those are different goals, and they may have some sacrifices involved. From a health perspective, and even from the perspective of, I just want to look good, it's not really necessary to kill yourself. There's a proper diet and a decent amount of stimulus with exercise, and depends on what you want to do, should be enough to maintain looking good and things like that, and to feeling good into being healthy, and besides just the idea of building muscle, because I think a lot of especially, at least where I've come from, and I think to some extent, where you've come from, the idea of exercise has been lifting weights, has been getting more muscle, has been things like that. And besides doing that, there's other the idea of play is important, and enjoying some of the exercise you're doing, like for example, just recently, picking up paddle boarding or something like that. It's enjoyable, doesn't? It doesn't seem like exercise. It's just something that's fun, if there's a degree of challenge in it, especially when you're first starting and you're trying to do it in surf and stuff like that. So that stuff, the play aspect, is engaging on a on a mental level, on a neurologic level, which is a physiologic level. And then the other thing is just moving in general, and just going through different ranges of motions and maintaining mobility. And I mean in moving, the movement in general moves the lymphatic system through or moves lymph throughout the body, through the lymphatic system, all that stuff there's has beneficial effects, besides the idea of building muscle and getting strong and having six pack abs and things like that. And I think that's what I mean, at least for me, for a long time. And I know, I know for a decent amount of people, that's their idea of of of movement and exercise and things like that. And for exercise in general, I think a broader category of movement and play and things like that is just important. And there's even studies just showing just daily walking, just walking in general, seeing new things and whatnot, is helpful in and of itself, from increasing insulin sensitivity and changing inflammatory markers and things like that. So just even movement like that is important, and getting outside and spending time outside and in the sun and things like that. So there's a whole series of aspects that I think are important. Besides the aspect of I need to deadlift 400 pounds, have six pack abs and a 72 inch pecs and just ridiculous things like that.Or, like, the excessive cardio, like the treadmill or elliptical for 30 minutes an hour, you know, all those sorts of things, or the lot of the boot camps and the classes where, and even the sports too. So, like, it's unfortunate, because a lot of those things are very enjoyable for people, where they want to participate in a sport, or they want to do some sort of class, but a lot of times, too, they're, really trying to push you, and they're and push you through that stress and into further and deeper stress. And it's not, it's rare that those sorts of things are built on, on, you know, moving well and not being too stressful, but being intense enough that you can handle it well and enjoy it. And so, so, yeah, finding. Finding that balance, and maybe, you know, and as you mentioned, paddleboarding is great. And there's a ton of other sports, whether it's pickup, martial arts, tennis or martial arts, which, again, the conditioning this can be detrimental. But yeah, there's a lot of options there. And as you mentioned, just walking has been incredibly is, like, shown to be helpful, hiking and things like that, where you're outside, also just moving around your house, like daily activities within the house have been shown to be impactful compared to just sitting for most of the day and being sedentary. So having that sort of movement, whether like in all of those forms, and as you're saying, it does not have to be in a gym. It does not have to be chronic cardio on machines. It does not have to be lifting weights. But having that movement, and if you want to call it exercise, is is really important, and I would say is important for Aging and Longevity, but not the stress side of it. And so we don't want to be forcing that stress side again. All this depends on your goals, but from the health, from a health perspective standpoint.And that doesn't mean that if you want to lift weights, to not lift weights, or if you want to go for a run, don't go for a run. I mean, I wouldn't say go for a 10 mile run, but you know, if you want to just go and do like, a nice jog around the block or in the park or something like that, I don't think any of those things are terrible. Or a walk around the park or anything, anything like that, is a terrible idea. If you enjoy lifting weights, or you want to go paddle board, or you want to go surf, or you want to go for a swim, I would say getting out of the idea of moving or exercising. Besides, you know, obviously lifting weights or something like that a gym is required, but running on a treadmill or doing the elliptical or something like that, what I would say probably be more beneficial. Go for a bike ride. Yeah, we're walking. Yeah, welcome. Go for a walk. Go for a walk around somewhere or something like that. I think that over because I think overall, even from a neurologic perspective, it'd be more stimulating seeing new things go on a new route or something like that. Or do go and do it with other people. Have a community aspect with it every go bike together, something like that. I think those things, those aspects, change this the response to the activity. So if you say, you go and and I'll give an example, I go play basketball. I'll go play basketball with my friends, right? I'll run a decent amount. I'll be out of breath. But I don't notice it. I don't feel it at all. Because of the stimulating aspect mentally of playing, playing the game and and interacting my friends and things like that. It changes it. It really does change it. Or even if you're doing martial arts with a bunch of other people, like if you do jujitsu, learning a new technique or or learning a different way to perform a particular technique, things like that, you could be out of breath, you could be a little bit tired, but you don't feel it because you're stimulated mentally by it. And you're having you're doing it, is like a community aspect. And so I think those things really, really can change some of the aspects and take it away from I need to do X number of minutes on the treadmill per day, and then I'm done, and it's like, oh, I have to do this. I think having that aspect of like, Yeah, I'm gonna, whatever about the treadmill. No treadmill. I'm going to go for a walk today. I'm going to go somewhere new to go for a walk. I'm going to go with my friends. We're going to go for a hike somewhere new, or we're going to go kayak somewhere new, or something like that. I think it would be a lot. You see a new place, and you're interacting with people, and you're also moving around and things like that. I think that that would be a lot more beneficial. And the other thing I want to point out here is a lot, I think a lot of the whole cardio and treadmills and ellipticals and things like that comes from perspective of maintaining weight and making sure that you maintain a specific figure. So I think movement is important to some extent for maintaining muscle mass and and muscle tone and things like that. But as far as not getting fat or not putting on excess weight, I think that mostly comes down to diet. Like very much, mostly, most significantly, comes down to diet. In my experience, I cannot work out at all, and my appetite will decrease a little bit, and then I could just, I just eat without having to specifically count calories or anything like that, and just, I just maintain my weight. So.Yeah, and I mean, movement can definitely be helpful there, for sure, it can be helpful dietary, yeah, but yeah.Everything comes down to diet for as far as weight maintenance and things like that, yeah.I think that's definitely a bigger component the Yeah, I do think, yeah, I do think movement is important, and not being sedentary can can make a big difference. It's all contextual. So it's hard to say in any you know, what is more impactful, but, but another thing I would say too, is we don't need to avoid intensity as far as exercise goes. But again, as you said, as you were mentioning, having it being mentally stimulating, cognitively stimulating does make a big difference, and also just doing it in the level that you can handle. So having it be intense and being out of breath is fine, but it's just a level of what, how far you push yourself and how conditioned you are for that. So those are things to keep in mind.Don't try 5k on your first day. Jay Feldman 35:00 Yeah. And you kind of alluded to to, like, the social side of things. And I do think that in talking about lifespan and aging, that is a pretty important component, just having having a stimulating life in general, whether that is doing things that you're passionate about, whether it is for work or outside of work, feeling like you're contributing, whether that's, again, through the work that you're doing most of the day, or through some sort of volunteering or just discussions with people or helping others in whatever way, I think that's all helpful, and having a social community that you feel a part of and are interacting with regularly, ideally in person, but a lot of that's online now too. But which I again, it's not a perfect substitute, but it does mean something to have some sort of community like that, but, but I think that's just another, another. I think that it's just.Mike 35:54 I think it's a huge component, especially because if you look at all the different Blue Zones and groups that have high amounts of longevity, the they all have different diets, but they're the one of the main factors that has strongly is like seen in all the groups, as community, a sense of community, and in particular the older people of society, being an important part of society and and being part of the family unit, and being a part of the community structure and having a place and things like that. So I think in almost every single one of those, in one of those communities, it's very the the community is extremely important. It's something that is focused on. And I think that that in and of itself, I mean, it's besides all the diet and this and that, I think that that's extremely important.Jay Feldman 36:43 And yeah, yeah. And along with that, too is stress, and like, the speed of the lifestyle is very different. In a lot of those blue zones, the there isn't the same chasing after money and working ourselves quite literally to death. And yeah, the priorities are different, and that, I think we would be ignoring a huge aspect here if we weren't talking about that and and the stress that we go through and the pressure that we put on ourselves. And it's, I'm not about to say that it's easy to work out of that, because a lot of us are chained, in many ways, to that sort of life. But working towards that in any capacity, I think is helpful. And having, you know the social side of things and community is really important there. And also, you know, things like spending time in nature and connecting in that way can make a difference. But just keeping reevaluating priorities and reevaluating your perspective life and how you're seeing things, and, you know, walking around with with a lot of anger and and heaviness and...Mike 37:52 Feeling things that you have to do right? I have to do that. I have to do this. I like, you can't relax. You can't just be like, I'm just gonna sit down and do nothing, and I'm okay, right?Jay Feldman 38:03 And yeah, that's kind of what I was gonna say, is the feeling of having to do something, as opposed to freedom. So it's like being chained to something and having that, that pressure and that, that inherent stress that comes with it. And of course, there are we have needs that we have to fulfill in modern day that often are do require some amount of stress, but the perspective through which the perspective that we have while we do them, does make a pretty big difference. And again, like with everything around us, it's very hard not to always be in that fight and flight type state. It's hard not to always be stressed and feeling like the world is collapsing and like everybody's against you, and it's the whole world is in this war, whether it's a war of words or physical. And a lot of that is, is, I don't want to say fabricated. It's, it exists, but it's..Mike 38:52 it's a part of the culture that, at least this culture.Jay Feldman 38:56 But it's, it's added. It's like a layer on top of reality, like when you exist in reality. A lot of that isn't present. A lot of it is present. I'm not if you..Mike 39:03 Don't watch the news, I never see any of that Jay Feldman 39:06 Exactly, yeah. And so I do think the more that we can separate ourselves from those things, limiting social media, limiting different forms of media, news outlets, is, is like goes, goes beyond words. How much of an impact I think those things can make, yeah?Mike 39:21 I mean, I think that in general, especially in Western culture, the culture itself is, in my opinion, toxic or or a large part of the problem Asian. And the way Asian culture and Asian culture, exactly, not Asian aging, yeah, it came may sound like Asian, but yeah.Jay Feldman 39:41 Yeah. Like, it ages you the culture, yeah, yeah, yeah.Mike 39:45 And just on multiple fronts, I mean, there's the values that are placed in within the current at the current culture is just, I think, are problematic for a lot of people. The focus on material gain and and. Material needs over over things like family and community and relaxation and taking care of yourself and and longevity and things like that. A lot of things are focused mainly on making money and achieving some sort of arbitrary status and things like that. And I mean, some of those things are important. You do need money to live. You do need resources and things like that, but at the same time, and there needs to be a balance, to some extent, with with having time for yourself, with taking care of yourself, with having community, with having leisure time, with all those types of things are really important, and I don't think that they're super valued to a lot of to a lot of what's going on in our society. A lot of things come down to profits. I mean, this is an entirely different conversation, but to some extent, and the thing is, is, I think recognizing it is important, and I don't think it's good idea to stress about the stress of the culture, but to know that there is other ways or other concepts of living besides being the model that we grew up in and things like that.Jay Feldman 41:03 Yeah, yeah, we've, we've quite literally been sold on this idea of consumerism. You had mentioned material things, but this idea that the things that we buy will fulfill us. They'll make us happy, whether it is a car or clothes that we feel like we need to express ourselves with, or or, you know, fancy house, whatever it is. And as you said, it's it's helpful to evaluate where those thought processes are coming from, how they bias our lives, what they influence us to do, and how much they take away from our focus on our family, our friends, ourselves, the real world around us, like the the trees, the grass and and and the sun, like, how what are we sacrificing in our lives daily for these things that we've been sold into thinking that we need, when in reality, we don't, and by not by moving away from that, how much freedom can we gain? And, yeah, as you said, it's not a matter of stressing about this. It's just a matter of of evaluating where our thought processes are, where our priorities are, and the and making small shifts towards.Mike 42:06 Towards there's an awareness. There needs to be an awareness about what you're I mean, a lot of people, I drive a BMW, or I drive a Mercedes Benz, and I live in a mansion, but I have a 50 inch waist diabetes, etc, etc. It's like, there's a lot, and I'm not, it's not to, it's not to make fun of anybody in those particular situations, but it's being aware of, what are you sacrificing for, what you're gaining, like, what are the what trade offs are you making? Are you working 80 hours a week to maintain those things and and having a hard time sleeping and things like that, just, you know, and if that's what you want to do, that's fine. If that's your decision, that's fine. But at the same time, I mean being aware of what what you're trading for, and in some cases, people are in situations financially and whatnot, where they have what they have to work like that. And I mean, I, I I understand, I, I don't. I don't know what else to tell people to get out of them. We can try and help with diet and stuff like that, and different supplements and whatnot, and lifestyle hacks and whatnot. But at the end of the day, some of that, the stress of those different situations, is problematic in and of itself, on physiology overall. The other thing before I know you want to jump in, but the other thing I want to point out is the element of competition in our society versus cooperation and collaboration. And I think that that's a huge one, where people are focused on and then, and the other thing is such a strong focus on the idea of the of the individual. And it's not to say that individualism isn't important and a focus on developing the self, but at the expense of looking at oneself as part of a community and things like that, and having to compete with other people, as opposed to collaborate and cooperate with and things like that, I think that that is problematic and and is antithetical to forming a community and things like that. Yeah.Jay Feldman 44:01 I agree. I mean, as we talked about the blue zones, which just, just these cultures where there is that more community, I think there's, there's something to be said for that, for sure. And yeah, and you had mentioned just kind of the, I don't know, like a picture of somebody who has a lot of money and they have their BMW, a nice house, but maybe their health isn't great, and a lot of times it does, you know, that might not be somebody who is overweight, it might be somebody who wakes up at 5am to work out for an hour before they get into the you know, they go home shower, and then they get to work by seven, and they're in the office until 7pm or whatever, and they work on weekends as well. And they might not be overweight, but that doesn't mean that they aren't healthy, stressed, and it also definitely does not mean that they're enjoying their lives, or they're spending enough time with the people they care about, or anything like that. And I'm sure a lot of those people are in a great place, and that's great if you enjoy that. I'm not making any judgments there. But for for most, I don't think it's I think that most of us, most people who are aspiring to those things, think that what they'll gain is. Is what they think they'll gain is not actually there. Obviously, everyone's looking for happiness and and contentment and that feeling, you know, they have this feeling of, once I get to this place, then everything will be different and, and there's, of course, there are people in tough situations where there is something to be said for that, but at the same token, there's also a lot to be said for working on our current perspective, the way that we look at the world at the moment, and living for that, or living, I'd say just living for the present moment, obviously, but like, but, but can, but living in the present, as opposed to always chasing the future. Yeah. All right. I hope you enjoyed that episode in that series talking about slowing aging and extending lifespan. If you did, please leave a review of like, a comment, a five star rating on iTunes or wherever else you're listening. It really does a lot to help support the podcast. To check out the show notes for today's episode, head over to Jay Feldman wellness.com/podcast and if you are dealing with any of these symptoms of aging, if you're looking to reverse that process, or any other low energy symptoms, whether that is joint pain or weight gain or gut symptoms like bloating or indigestion, maybe you're dealing with excessive amounts of hunger and cravings, hormonal imbalances, a lack of energy throughout the day. Maybe you're not sleeping well. If you're dealing with any of those symptoms, head over to Jay Feldman wellness.com/energy, and sign up for a free energy balance mini course where I will walk you through why we want to be optimizing energy, to optimize all these symptoms and all sorts of other chronic health conditions, and also what we can do about it, what we should be adjusting as far as nutrition and lifestyle are concerned, in order to reach that point of energy balance, in order to optimize our cellular energy producing systems. So to sign up for that free energy balance mini course, head over to Jay Feldman wellness.com/energy, and I will see you in the next episode.